Curse

thestealthcow101 · Jul 22, 2005, 05:28 AM // 05:28

OK, right now, I'm really having a problem balancing out my attribute points...I have 30 more comming, but I don't think I'll get them for a while, judging by the way my friends talk about how hard the game gets...so..

I was thinking, should i even waste attribute points on marksmenship? I'm a warrior/ranger, yes, I know my choice isn't that great, but I had great plans for it...it just didn't work out. But, I adjusted to it, and decided that I'll just get used to it.

Now, I'm enjoying being a ranger. I'd prefer being an elementalist secondary, but I'll just wait till I'm at that part of the game. Traps are really cool, and when he's not getting in my way of enemies, my pet is really helpful.

But...I'm not sure if I'm wasting my precious attribute points on marksmenship or not. I've been thinking about it since I got my new armor, and need to get the helmet, which means I'll loose my -1 swordsmanship (duelist cap...and no, I won't get the stronger one. the platemail helm is too awesome to resist, and completes my armor set). Doesn't seem like much, but considering I NEED 12 swordsmanship to use my sword, the cap completes it, removing the cap will leave me with 11 swords. 16 go to the next level.

And my strength, I belive, is too low.

And then I looked at my marksmenship. I was going to increase it so I could use my bow, but then that plan went out the door. And I started thinking, "Do I even use my bow that much?"

I looked at my skill bar; 0 skills which use the bow (frenzy stance doesn't count, thats for my sword mainly) and I started thinking about the last time I used my bow, for anything but the sake of not wasting a weapon, and I couldn't. I don't remeber the last time i took out an enemy using the bow alone. I rarely take out my bow for the first shot on an enemy anymore, it's just not worth it.

With 9 points in marksmanship, I can't help thinking how much that can help me, but I also think about how wasteful of a profession it'd be to not be able to use any bow with a ranger. But, I mean, the amount of times I pull out my bow is so low, I just don't know.

This happen to anyone else? What do you guys reccomend I do?

OK, I just read over my post and found it hard to read myself, so here's a short summary:

I think I'm wasting attribute points I need badly on my marksmanship because I rarely use my bow, but I find it hard to just waste a classes weapon like that.

ShadowWrath · Jul 22, 2005, 05:31 AM // 05:31

You don't need to use a bow to be a ranger. Plus many ranger bow attacks are costly without Expertise.

entropy · Jul 22, 2005, 05:40 AM // 05:40

If u r using swords then dont use the marksmenship. cause switching bewtween to weps in the middle of battle is costly. And the skills for two different weapons taku up too much space or ur skill bar. sword skills might be like 3+ im guessing and ranging i would guess at least 1 so... plus other warrior skills if u want to use ur secondary use push ur bm to 4 for tigers fury and then push ur wilderness up. Wilderness has got some nice skills

theclam · Jul 22, 2005, 05:42 AM // 05:42

You only want to use one item type for doing damage. Warriors should usually use a Hammer, a Sword, or an Axe. A bow is a useful tool for a Warrior, but ONLY for pulling. Otherwise, it's not worth it, since melee weapons usually do more DPS. For a Warrior, a safe skill point spread would be some in Strength (at least, enough to use a shield, in PvE, unless you're hammer), some in Axes, Hammers, or Swords, and some in something else.

thestealthcow101 · Jul 22, 2005, 05:56 AM // 05:56

well, I'm not planning on changing my shield anytime soon, which has a tactics requirement...sadly. It's from a collector, and I haven't seen a shield better than +45 health and -2 recived damage...but I guess the tactics req really brings it down.

My axe and hammer attributes=0. I can't stand hammers, they're too slow, and there's something about axes I really don't like.

My strength is at 8, but it'll be 9 soon. Axe and hammer are 0, swordsmanship is 12 but will be 11 soon, and tactics is at 9. I really want a strength based shield, because a lot more stuff I use often is based on strength (occasionally i equipped shouts, which are tactics, but i always have strength-based skills) but I can't come to buying a shield with lower stats than mine...although I realize the extra strength will boost my attacks.

aB- · Jul 22, 2005, 06:26 AM // 06:26

I believe strength is overall better as well for the passive armor penetration bonus it gives. Have you thought about using a minor/major/superior rune to boost your swordsmanship up? Using just a minor will save you 20 points, a major will save you 36 points, and a superior will save you 49 points, plus if you use a minor rune for some other attribute, you still have only -75 health. Then just a major vigor at least will bring that penalty down to -35 health. Not too shabby considering how many points you can save.

In general, you should only use one weapon class. If you use 2 you become less effective with each, as you can't properly distribute attributes or skills. It's better to be very effective at one and not another than to be mediocre at both. Being a W/R I would reccomend using your sword only as bow skills are expensive without expertise as someone stated, and you have less energy regeneration than a ranger.

And where are you currently, because you might not be TOO terribly far from the attribute quests.

thestealthcow101 · Jul 22, 2005, 07:45 AM // 07:45

actually, i have no idea how much further the attribute quests are. right now, i'm on the auroa glade mission, but i'm also exploring around the droknar area...i have the ice caves mission avalible.

Thanks for all the advice, guys. i'm now convinced. my bow is worthless and i could be much better with my sword. i do notice ranger skills costing so much, bow skills. its just not worth it to loose 3 of my attacks that require energy to one bow skill that does equal damage to a normal sword attack.

right now i have a minor sword rune equipped, as well as many others, including major vigor, so i'll consider buying a major sword.

again, thanks for the quick and helpful replies.

noblepaladin · Jul 22, 2005, 02:15 PM // 14:15

People underestimate warriors with bows! I remember playing in some of the later missions like Abbandon's Mouth and we couldn't find many other classes that wanted to party so I had a group of mostly warriors and when we had some trouble, everybody pulled out 8 longbows and focused fired on stuff like ether seals or stuff that are really far away (we had to pick off some targets before charging in because there were too many enemies at some points to engage them directly). Even without the necessary requirements, you'd be surprised at how quickly things lose health when 8 arrows fly at it every second.

Kuku Monk · Jul 22, 2005, 02:21 PM // 14:21

I love the W/R combo. One advantage to this is "Apply Poison." Hit an enemy with that and any bleeding attack and watch their health disintegrate.

KvanCetre · Jul 22, 2005, 02:40 PM // 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kuku Monk

I love the W/R combo. One advantage to this is "Apply Poison." Hit an enemy with that and any bleeding attack and watch their health disintegrate.

I've actually had some luck in PvP with a R/W with a hammer. I brought it for the lightning resist against spikers.

Of course, I lost out on Strength... which I normally bring for my hammer warriors.

RTSFirebat · Jul 22, 2005, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowWrath

You don't need to use a bow to be a ranger. Plus many ranger bow attacks are costly without Expertise.

True, but since bows require Marksmanship to do any real damage, using one on that class combo like that would be pointless as the weapon would do no worthwhile damage whats so ever.

Albertt · Jul 22, 2005, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by KvanCetre

I've actually had some luck in PvP with a R/W with a hammer. I brought it for the lightning resist against spikers.

Of course, I lost out on Strength... which I normally bring for my hammer warriors.

I never had luck with a hammer.........

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www.guildwarsthegame.tk

Sekkira · Jul 22, 2005, 03:56 PM // 15:56

I'd go with Wilderness Survival or Beastmastery.

Fungus Amongus · Jul 22, 2005, 05:02 PM // 17:02

Check into the expertise line. It has some nice evasive skills, and ways to increase attack speed. The points in expertise will also reduce the energy cost of using those skills, too, which should be good because you don't have much as a warrior. Since you are normally going to be in the frontline, the evasive skills will keep you from getting hit as often too.

Examples:

Lightning Reflexes - Stance
For 5-10 seconds, you have a 75% chance to "evade" melee and arrow attacks, and attack 33% faster.

Throw Dirt - Skill
Target touched foe and foes adjacent to your target are Blinded for 3-13 seconds.

Whirling Defense - Stance
For 8-18 seconds, you have a 75% chance to "Block" attacks. Whenever you block an attack this way, adjacent foes take 5-10 piercing damage.

Lorelei · Jul 22, 2005, 05:37 PM // 17:37

Hey hey, another brave warrior with pet. I feel less lonely now

Bow is useful but put too much marksmanship on it isn't the right thing to do, I feel. A 3 on it because a bow require a 3, that's all I have to spare. The bow is useful (for pulling, as already pointed out, or when you are play protector). You could attack with your pet and still could fire some arrows. It builds up adrenaline also, so switching weapon in middle of engagement isn't bad. In PvE, it allows you to move in with a hammer or an axe (or a sword in your case) when enemies are already engaged: jump into melee where you could make most damage.

BrandonIT · Jul 22, 2005, 06:30 PM // 18:30

To the poster about the Expertise skills, Expertise is the Ranger Primary attribute, as a Warrior/Ranger he doesn't have that attribute.

I play a Warrior/Ranger and I have no points in Marksmanship. Mainly because my bow is only for pulling. I can count on one hand the times I've killed an enemy with my bow alone since I started the character and I'm level 14 now in Borliss Pass.

I'd recommend putting your points maybe into Wilderness Survival, use Apply Poison, and then start whacking with your sword since Apply Poison works on swords I hear.

Or put your points into Beast Mastery and get that pet damage up.
See http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=20579 for more info on how BM affects pet damage.

Warrior/Ranger is a good class combo IMHO, but I don't think Marksmanship should play a big role in it unless you're going to concentrate on the bow solely.

Ollj · Jul 22, 2005, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Warrior ranger is a tricky combo in general, its focused in attacks, Melee AND ranged.
when you use swordsmanship push it to 16 or just dont use swordsmanship because its a spikey atribute, each swordsmanship skill increases much per atribute point in it.

Only Gash increases slowly so its "most effective" around 7 swordsmanship, so just dont use that skill.
Same with sewer artery and hamstring, here its around 12 swordsmanship.
all the above are sword--skills for secondary warriors only!!!
Hundred blades is just as good with any atribute skill, use it or not.
ALL other swordsmanship skills are mot effective around 16 sworsmanship because their numbers increase so much!

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so now that you pushed swordsmanship to 16 (12+4) already, theres not much left for others. So thats your atribute settings with a 12 (or 11) in it:

12 12 3
(12 sword 12 strenght 3 rest)
Youre based on your sword (like most other players) and have 3 rest for your ranger skills:
Those are your ranger skills that are "most effective" with only 0 or 5 atribute points in it AND that are usefull for a sword warrior:
-
Flame Trap (expensive, and the lowest-atr trap for a ranger, so this is for your warriors!!!)
Throw Dirt (Hey, this one is great against rangers and warriors)
Antidote Signet (cheap signet, not THAT good, but still usefull)
Crippling Shot (expensive, but good against if you want to escape)
Marksman's Wager (cheap, to gain energy, okay I asume its a wicked sword warrior strat)
-
Punishing Shot (expensive, but interrupts are always good to have)
Point Blank Shot (expensive, but fits in for a warrior)
Power Shot (expensive, but fits in for a warrior, too)
Precision Shot (expensive, but fits in for a warrior, too)
-
Charm Animal (Yes, you can have an animal as primary warrior (but it wont live long, so its basically a sacrifice for necros))
Call of Haste (and thats your skill for it then, expensive but long charge time makes it worth it)
Otyugh's Cry (only usefull in PvE, but it fits to a primary sword warrior)

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12 8 8 7 1
(12 sword 8 strenght) 8,7,1 rest)
11 11 8 3 2
(11 sword 11 strenght 8,3,2 rest) [11 swordmanship? shame on you!! (only usefull if you barely use swordsmanship skills, but thats paradox to what i sayd above)]
11 9 8 8 1
(11 sword 9 strenght 8,8,1 rest) [11 sworsmanship and even less space swordmanship skills?? your try, I wont!!]
11 8 8 7 6
(11 sword 8 strenght 8,7,6 rest) [11 swordsmanship less strenght for a more wicked build]

Youre still based on your sword (with less strenght (and less swordsmanship)) and have 2 times ~ 8 atributes to spend in ranger skills (or whatever):
Those are your ranger skills that are "most effective" with only 7-8 atribute points in it AND that are usefull for a sword warrior:
And you can still use charm animal and call of haste for a weak pet

(only a good idea with necros on your side so you sacrifice your pet for them)
-
Symbiotic bond (expensive, and only usefull if you want your pet alife longer whilke draining your hp)
Fertile Season (keeps ypur pet alife longer, but not much because its weak)
Ferocious strike (if you want to use an elite skill on your kamikaze-pet, barely usefull but that depends)
-
Tigewrs fury (a must have for primary warriors)
Dodge (a must have against rangers)
Whirling defense (a must have for warriors)
Savage Shot (interuption always good)
Dryders Defense (go get some elemental defense here)
Lightning Reflexes (more expensive, usefulness is more general for warriors)
Melandru's Resilience (this one is fun when you have conditions and hexes)
Read the wind (its worth it, as primary warrior with a bow)
Troll unguent (only usefull with 8 atributes in it)

--------
11 10 10 1
(11 sword 10 strenght 10,1 rest) [this would be your Sword warrior beast master]
"all pet skills"
you can "almost" use Bestial Pounce,Brutal Strike,Melandru's Assault,Predator's Pounce,Maiming Strike,Scavenger Strike effectly with 8 beast mastery (10 is perfect)
The problem with this is that you sould only use 3-4 swordsmanship skills with that and you NEED a skill to gain energy for your pet skills!

-------

[all other combos are kinda crappy for a specialized build like yours (using sword and strenght) because they split over to many atributes]

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Summary Wa/R MAYBE should not use swords because swordsmanship requires MUCH specialiation in its atribute!!
The Hammer skills Belly Smash,Devastating Hammer,Crushing Blow
and the Axe Skills Cleave,Cyclone Axe,Eviscerate,Executioner's Strike,Penetrating Blow,Dismember
run best around 10 atribute points (And other skills of the same atribute can use more) so you are more flexible with other weapons as a W/R !